now. >> conservatives at cpac calling for tax cuts, but the president telling republicans, they can hike them or take a hike in budget cuts . senate democrats are on his side, pushing one trillion in new taxings. is this why 7 out of 10 bosses are not hiring. this is bums and bears we'll get right to it. the bums and bears, to bin and jonas and john back from his mountain climb and jamull green. >> democrats are still pushing

tax hikings. is that why the companies are not hiring? >> absolutely. alm they -- all they have to do is look at history or the state nearby. on the state lemp, - level. the states that grow the most jobs are the ones without income tax. we have had this discussion many times. every time we cut taxes, the economy has grown whether on the left with president kennedy or left with reagan. the left said clinton raised taxes and what is often ignored, clinton cut the capitol gains tax and he cut spending as aercentage of gdp. the obama administration want to go the opposite way, if they do they will make fdr a libitarian. >> jamull is it good or bad

for the economy? >> i don't think the president said that they should take a hike if the tax hikings don't happen. our biggest problem are the spending cuts . bigger than that are the job losses, and so i am going to talk about tax cuts, a huge one to see happen the vernment should give tax cut to companies so they can hire new workerings, spending cuts and focusing on the dicit, that is moving us in the wronging direction. if we want to talk about tax cuts, give the corporations that are sitting on records and the dow closed at record highs, give them a tax cut to hire new workers. >> toby, tax hikings are the issue here. this is what dems are calling for. is this the time with the recovery, so, so iffy to do

that? >> no remember the president said if you don't go up the tax hikes, i am not do a budget. you can't say he is not playing games here. we created the most jobs in '95 to 2000 in that time frame. were we cutting taxes or paying companies to hire people with tax credits, no? >> you hire somebody that is investment and when we make an investment, that allowed people to say if my investment is successful, and then we'll generate capt cament. we don't need tax credits. you hire because of the good investment. jon as. do you need tax hikings even in the tepid recover? >> we already had tax increases this year and some of them are on hiring and the pay roll tax returning to the same level. there is drags on the economy and we'll need more taxes to close the gaps. companies would like taxes to

be low but also don'tment -- don't want to collapse the economy. theymentment economy to grow and not go broke and some mix of spending cuts and tax increases will hopefully lead us down the path but not the japan path. i don't know which plan is better. they are both magic in my opinion. one wants taxes raised and the other want to lower it twitch percent like that is going to balance the budget. i don't know which one is working. >> johnathon, you took a hike up a big mountain, should taxings go up? >> no, they shouldn't unless they are paying off the debt. we are raising a trillion in taxes according to the democratic proposal.

you are only raising taxes to raise spending also. you are not paying off the deficit. governor scott and perry, come to the states where you don't have to pay a state income tax. that's what businesses want. this democratic budget is the biggest joke i have ever seen. 10 years from now. you are still running a trillion dollar deficit. nothing is done with this. it is it horrible. >> jamu? >>gain, the deficit is not our problem. we need to find the resource. >> wait a minute. >> that sounds like greece. >> that is not our biggest problem. you are making a mountain out of a molehill. >> i don't think we are making a mountain out of a mole hill. >> a fair and balanced approach and seeing some taxings going up will help us

with the infrastructure spending that the economy need and help the statings and citis and local governments that have massive budget cuts. >> we are focusg rht now and we are talking about tax hikings. we are not talking about spending cuts. but talk about tax hikings. gary, respond to this right now. we are in a recovery that is not doing very well. you have shown us the historical side of things whampt will that do? >> i don't know how many more arguments the left needs to hear that tax hikings don't work. they keepoing back tomit same well . yet, up go through, brenda, i hate to keep pounding on it, lowering taxing when europe or canada or states do, it is it the way to grow the economy. when we raise taxings the government gets more money and

the government takes our money is spend it inefficiently. my the department of the agriculture is a better way to spend our money. the department of defense spends so efficiently. no one can make that argument. >> but gary, if you look at tax hikes, you are saying the historical perspective. the democrats are going back to the 1980ings. raise taxes on certain partings. we did that with social security because five or six people working for every one beneficencary. today two people are working for one. we can't afford it they are pretending our economy ishe same as in the 80s. >> we could afford it, the left tells us not to worry about it. apparently we don't have to worry about it.

>> it worked so well . take it and work and expect a different out come. >> i don't think the tax cuts worked so well they are flawed because they are not matching spending. >> went up. >> there is no question, a company whosomes - who sells goods to the consumer would prefer the taxes. will smend if taxings go down. or have to borrow the difference. it doesn't mean there is it a 5 or 10 percent tax reality. long run it will coitself - coapse itself. we want gradual tax increases that don't kick in with the economy is coming out of a bad time. >> jonas, ireland and hong kong, you lower it. >> it collapsed because they didn't bring in taxes to cover

the spending. that's what happened. >> we are not talking about ireland on st. patrick's day. >> sure we are. >> america is doing something that is making the chics and celebrities angry and cavuto and the gang said that must mean we are doing something right. but first, consumers forced to pay out ooze prices shoot up. what is behind the price spike and why is to

routine military drills. consumer confidence down as consumer prices go up on everything. food, gas and tickets and legal fees and even the cost to prepare your taxings. the index showing the biggest monthly gain in four years. but the government is saying forget about it. inflation is not a problem, john, is it? >> yes, absolutely. these guys are whistling pass want grave yard as they are doing with everything else on the agenda. corn prices doubled in the past few years and gasolines are high . people are having a struggle out there and the fed at zero interest, there is no ability to absorb a systemic shock. you have the problem of promise having to raise rates because of inflation into a recession. these guys are whistling past

the grave yd and it is not a good thing for america. >> gary is not whistling but laughing, why? >> again, in falms - falls into the blackhawk helicopter conspiracy theory. you look at the numbers and year to year inflation is two percent. everyone said we can't trust the number. we used the number from the government. point 7 percent. lampt month. yes, everyone saw gasoline energy prices up 8 or nine percent. that hurts and stinkings is 10 percent . average person's budget. if it 100%, we woulde pulling our hai out. inflation across the board. food up two percent. it seems like a not but it is not unless you don't believe the numbers. >> no, healthcare and the cost of the college and energy prices and rent, all of tholce

thgs are way up. >> remember want cpi is a formula and a big part of the formula is housing costs . because housing compts is low. we have close - foreclosure . they get skewed. but in the real world. when he's lying out in the chaise lounge and all kippeds out of college it affect gary. but the real people college goes up eight percent. their premiums am double with want obama care in the next few months and they have x amount to sphend. wages are not going up. that's where the squeeze is at. >> that is a good point, john. prices go up this much and wages stay here. >> first of all, i would like to say it is not because of

the inflation it is a tax code that is more complicated. but getting to your point only reason inflation is high right now wage growth until recently is underperforming. prices going up two percent it is mild. pay is going up one percent that is a bad situation. wagings are going up four percent that is a low inflation rate . also if you are living on a fixed income . trying to buy a cd and money market accountings and it seems like a lot of inflation f. you own a lot of the stockings it doesn't feel so bad. >> jamu, are you worried about inflation? >> no, it is it modest compaper tod historical standards and that two percent that is up is the fed target for long-term inflation. we have to look at it

fluxeating depending on what you are purchasing, gas is up right n. higher than three months ago. but lower than six monthings. fooled prices are up . alcoholic beverages are down. it affect toby but it does people out there . long-term it is modest. they are right. >> john, last word? >> look cornri went from 3.50 to spevendollars a bushel. that is not tame. food prices have gone up and look with the fed zero inflation and zero rate right now. if they have to raise rates because of inflation we are in trouble. >> toby, i have to let you get in there. >> it is it what people feel at home. real people at real homes are feeling it and it is affect being their outlook and spending, no question. >> and usually uniguys support

democrats, why are these guys shouting this democrat down? why someone here said more scenes like this and nonunion workerbs are going - workerbs are going to be very happy. [beep] [indistinct chatter]

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philadelphia democratic mayor walked out of the address. they a mad over a contract stalemate. it shows why right to work is the way to go. >> yay, the protest in north carolina and texas say our wages are higher and job rights are higher and employment rates are higher and remember not right to work is simply the idea of joining in and pay t dues if you don't want to. that sounds like america to me. the idea of imposing dues. i would like to have a politician stop speaking halfway through. but this is a guy living in want 1980s it is a time warp and they don't get the economic facts as they are today. >> jam u, the mayor had to walk out of that? >> toby is right. this is america and yelling

and screaming when something is not going the way you want it is how we have done a lot of socialhange in this country. it shows that unions are equal opportunity offenders. they will go after democrats that are not doing what they and want they will go aer republicans on equal spending. unions we have to keep in mind are the main reasons that wages go up. so yes, they need to continue yell screaming and so that we can see the wages rise. they have not benefited from the recovery. >> and we have flashed on the screen the various actul numbers from the coe and about the right to work state versus none. it is it a slam dunk. >> and so gary b succeeded in shouting down the mayor and are they really winning the big battles? >> absolutely not.

we have said many times, union membership is on the decline. it is kind much in a permanent free fall. unions are monopolies and demand artificially high wagings. in greece, they are upset when the dole is going to go away and the average carpenter gets 40 miles per hour. that is a heck of a lolt of money. peop s oh, my gosh my salary is going away . people get upset. jamu is right. i would be protesting, too. but i am not sure they are qualified for the job. >> is it a coincidence that wages stagnated while the unions came under attack? >> (talking all at once.) >> we are not get nothing that economic argument. >> there is really a potf gold in the state of pennsylvania, not giving

raises to the union members and then they protest and would back the labor. there is a lot of -- between losing labor and jobs and people moving, and 50 years of bad union contracts that have bank rumented want pension, you can't blame the mayor. you can't squeeze blood out of a rock. >> john, word for you. >> look comparing a bunch of people to yelling out and does ive disservice to those who did things for social change. i believe that employees and employers have right to hire people who are not in unions. toby is exactly right. >> guys, that is the word . jamu, thank you for joining us. we always appreciate i >> the na giving apple an run for

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